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Resurrecting the Mighty Mammoth, Cheaply

Posted by timothy on Thu Nov 20, 2008 06:34 PM
from the when-faster-and-cheaper-are-synonymous dept.
somanyrobots writes with an interesting followup in the New York Times to the earlier-reported substantial reconstruction of the woolly mammoth genome: "Scientists are talking for the first time about the old idea of resurrecting extinct species as if this staple of science fiction is a realistic possibility, saying that a living mammoth could perhaps be regenerated for as little as $10 million. The same technology could be applied to any other extinct species from which one can obtain hair, horn, hooves, fur or feathers, and which went extinct within the last 60,000 years, the effective age limit for DNA." (The Washington Post article linked from the earlier post was much more skeptical, calling such an attempt "still firmly the domain of science fiction." The New York Times article, while describing the process in similar terms, also calls attention to recent advances in sequencing DNA, as well as recoding DNA for cloning.)
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  • by Anonymous Coward on Thursday November 20 2008, @06:38PM (#25839661)

    Anyone got some amber they want to sell?

    -or-

    Yo mamma so fat, it'd cost 10 billion to clone her!

  • Good! (Score:5, Funny)

    by owlnation (858981) on Thursday November 20 2008, @06:41PM (#25839679)
    We may well need an army of Mammoths to fight the mutant tool-equipped space spiders from that other earlier story. $10 million is a small price to pay to save humanity from the giant space webs.
  • by Phrogman (80473) on Thursday November 20 2008, @06:53PM (#25839819) Homepage

    Well, the first few we resurrect will be interesting and a tourist attraction and all that, but once the public is used to them there has to be a practical application.

    Mammoth Burgers sound good to me :)

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      My thoughts exactly... since these critters were apparently hunted into extinction by early humans, I can only surmise that they must have been really good eatin'! I'm sure we'll have no problem raising the money to clone these beasties if we just promise everybody that contributes a good mammoth meal. However, I think the $10 million estimate is way too low; this is a 100-year project since you're starting with an elephant surrogate and you don't have a true mammoth until you've gone through several genera
  • Mmmmmmm (Score:4, Funny)

    by jaxtherat (1165473) on Thursday November 20 2008, @06:56PM (#25839839) Homepage

    Mammoth ribs :)

    *goes back to watching Flintstones*

    • " Mammoth ribs :)

      *goes back to watching Flintstones*"

      Awww shit.

      I'm gonna have to buy a much LARGER smoker.....

  • by dfm3 (830843) on Thursday November 20 2008, @06:59PM (#25839877) Journal

    The article hints at the possibility of bringing back other species, but doesn't elaborate. We have museum specimens of other extinct species such as the passenger pigeon [wikipedia.org], Carolina parakeet [wikipedia.org], and ivory-billed woodpecker, and those are certainly much more recent (all 3 species went extinct within the last century). Doesn't this open up the possibility of bringing back a few of these species, too?

  • more exciting (Score:5, Interesting)

    is, from the same story, relegated to second interest, for some reason, the idea of resurrecting a neanderthal, the same way as the woolly mammoth. using chimpanzee as the starting cell lineage rather than human, for ethical considerations of course

    but this guy won't be dumb. somebody will have to explain to him he's not the last of his kind... he is the 50,000 year old cloned reconstruction of his kind

    weird, lonely, and possible on our lifetime

    very cool, very freaky

      • by CorporateSuit (1319461) on Thursday November 20 2008, @07:39PM (#25840277)

        But seriously, the prospect of bringing a flawed misfit sentient being into this world and explaining to them "oh, by the way, your species is extinct!" doesn't seem very humane or ethical to me.

        You know... I didn't think I'd be the one to tell you this... but Locke2005, have you ever wondered why you were so much hairier than your "biological" father? Ever wonder why kids giggled when your name "Ug" was read in classrooms, and why you prefer deerskin over cashmir?

        I'm sure you've come to the correct conclusion by now... If you don't believe me, the proof is right before your eyes. You're posting excitedly in a news post about mammoth burgers.

        I'll let you get back to your flint and tinder... and... we're sorry about your entire species.

  • by FornaxChemica (968594) on Thursday November 20 2008, @07:02PM (#25839917) Homepage Journal

    Of course that's fascinating, but what would they do with a mammoth? Polar bears are becoming endangered because of rising temperatures and mammoths have disappeared, supposedly because the climate was too warm. They'll have to build a large freezer to keep the beast alive--Jurassic Park meets Frosty the Snowman--or they might not find a place cold enough on Earth for that purpose.

    What about the Dodo [wikipedia.org]? Any bits left?

    That's a strange coincidence they're talking about this JP-like experiment a few weeks after Michael Crichton's death. Posthumous humour?

    • by HTH NE1 (675604) on Thursday November 20 2008, @08:10PM (#25840573)

      What about the Dodo [wikipedia.org]? Any bits left?

      Save the dodo, extinct the coelacanth.

      "If the Universe came to an end every time there was some uncertainty about what had happened in it, it would never have got beyond the first picosecond. And many of course don't. It's like a human body, you see. A few cuts and bruises here and there don't hurt it. Not even major surgery if it's done properly. Paradoxes are just the scar tissue. Time and space heal themselves up around them and people simply remember a version of events which makes as much sense as they require it to make.

      "That isn't to say that if you get involved in a paradox a few things won't strike you as being very odd, but if you've got through life without that already happening to you, then I don't know which Universe you've been living in, but it isn't this one."

      "Well, if that's the case," said Richard, "why were you so fierce about not doing anything to save the dodo?"

      Reg sighed. "You don't understand at all. The dodo wouldn't have died if I hadn't worked so hard to save the coelacanth."

      "The coelacanth? The prehistoric fish? But how could one possibly affect the other?"

      "Ah. Now there you're asking. The complexities of cause and effect defy analysis. Not only is the continuum like a human body, it is also very like a piece of badly put up wallpaper. Push down a bubble somewhere, another one pops up somewhere else. There are no more dodos because of my interference. In the end I imposed the rule on myself because I simply couldn't bear it any more. The only thing that really gets hurt when you try and change time is yourself."

      -- Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency, Douglas Adams

  • by pinguwin (807635) on Thursday November 20 2008, @07:12PM (#25840025)
    It's far from certain that mammoth died out simply from climate change. Take a look at this link: http://packrat.aml.arizona.edu/Journal/v37n1/vartanyan.html [arizona.edu] Mammoth survived thousands of years beyond what most people think, into historic times (1700 b.c) It was a place that man didn't reach (hmmm...coincidence?), but Wrangel Island was too small to support a large population of them. It seems that wherever man went, large animals encountered "climate change". I don't doubt that climate was an issue, but nor do I doubt that man was either.
  • by orkysoft (93727) <orkysoft.myrealbox@com> on Thursday November 20 2008, @07:45PM (#25840309) Homepage Journal

    Stephen Baxter's Behemoth [amazon.com] is an omnibus of three books which deal with mammoths. The third book is actually about mammoths being genetically engineered back into existence, and there is actually one individual who is halfway between elephant and mammoth. Very cool books.

  • by kbob88 (951258) on Thursday November 20 2008, @08:03PM (#25840493)

    Forget rides to the space station or owning an electronic car company... the new must-have for tech multi-millionaires should be having your own herd of resurrected extinct species.

    Somebody call Sergey and Larry and see if they can spare $10mm. Just don't fly the 767 for a few weeks and that'll save enough for the effort.

    Then call Elon Musk and see if he wants to recreate the dodo or the Tasmanian tiger.

    Or we make it trendy for celebrities -- forget adopting babies from Africa, the new trend is adopting and recreating extinct species! Get Angelina on board and everyone else will follow.

  • by SIR_Taco (467460) <phil.woodlandNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Thursday November 20 2008, @08:36PM (#25840803) Homepage

    bring Michael Crichton back! ... man that post anonymously button looks pretty good right now... oh well

  • Endangered Species? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by charlie763 (529636) on Thursday November 20 2008, @10:18PM (#25841443) Homepage
    If one is made, would it then be considered an endangered species?
  • Aurochs (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Zygamorph (917923) on Thursday November 20 2008, @10:38PM (#25841571)
    According to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aurochs [wikipedia.org] there was an attempt to recreate the extinct species of cow called an Auroch. The idea was to identify currently existing cattle that had partial Auroch ancestry and breed them, selecting for Auroch characteristics. Essentially you were building a gene pool that contained all the necessary genes mixed in with others, running everything through a filter and trying to just get the ones you wanted. They were partially successful
    • It really just sounds like you're saying we need more than one.
    • Re:Frankenstein (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Jeremi (14640) on Thursday November 20 2008, @06:58PM (#25839869) Homepage

      What about the animal? The poor thing will be the only one of its species in existence. No chance of reproduction (unless it's close enough to an elephant to mate), no herd to grow up in, no point to its life other than for us to ooh and aah over.

      And yet would the mammoth's life experiences be any different from those of millions of other animals being kept as pets already? It would certainly have a much longer and healthier life than that of your average cow, chicken, or lab rat....

      I think your sympathies are misplaced.

      As for whether there would be a "point" to its life... it would be a significant scientific and technological milestone. That's more "point" than most domesticated animals have.

      • Re:Frankenstein (Score:5, Interesting)

        by NotBornYesterday (1093817) * on Thursday November 20 2008, @07:22PM (#25840127) Journal

        His post assumes that we wouldn't try to establish a breeding population. If we plan on bringing back an extinct species, what moral obligation do we have to prevent its extinction when the only specimen dies? Or is it okay, since our world has moved on since the last mammoth lived? If scientists make one, should we make more and restore a population? Would today's world be a good environment for a wild population or not? Would our creations be forever destined to live in zoos?

        If we create a breeding population, how do we ensure genetic diversity? I am not a bioengineer, and have no way of knowing if diversity is already included in their method (taking a living elephant's skin cell and slowly reshuffling the DNA from elephant to mammoth) by simply using cells from different donor elephants for making each new mammoth. I guess that would depend on how reshuffled the DNA gets in the process of injecting new sequences.

        • Re:Frankenstein (Score:4, Insightful)

          by sbeckstead (555647) on Thursday November 20 2008, @08:15PM (#25840623) Homepage Journal
          Look what we did for the American Bison, I mean they are tasty and all but we still stopped at the last minute. Now everyone can have buffalo steaks if they want one. Why not bring 'em back and farm them for food. We used them for that once and these things produce a whole lot more meat than buffalo.
            • Khm... (Score:5, Funny)

              by denzacar (181829) on Friday November 21 2008, @04:18AM (#25843121)

              "Making" mammoths would give us the ability to.. umm... flavor them.
              Buttery mammoth, Bananamammoth, Cinnamammoth, Fruity mammoth, Orange mammoth, Pear mammoth, Pineapple mammoth, Cotton candy mammoth, Wintergreen mammoth, Bitter almond mammoth, Vanilla mammoth with Swiss Mocha Chips & Blueberry Swirl, Chocolate mammoth with Chocolate Covered Coconut Bits & Marshmallow Swirl...

              And that would be just the beginning.

              I can't wait for the streets to be illuminated by phosphorescent, minty flavored, mini-mammoths.

        • by zogger (617870) on Thursday November 20 2008, @07:50PM (#25840373) Homepage Journal

          Man just lived and existed, there was no idyllic eden like harmony. change occurs constantly, that ole evolution thing. Where man goes or is, change happens. Same as where these mammoths went (five tons of pachyderm beef can cause some localized disruption, just like elephants today cause deserts eventually by tearing down trees) We fought and killed and caused whoops forest fires and so on, made creeks run dirty from digging clams and mussels on the banks, caused erosion from harvesting tubers, changed the balance of the local flora by starting agriculture, took food from other animals by that same reason, ate the other animals, skinned critters to make our clothes and shelters, all of that stuff. If you mean just living feral as being in harmony, you still can, it's quite possible, just back away from the keyboard and go for it, I did it for several years, was quite a hoot actually. I consider it a large part of my education and what makes me appreciate life better and helped establish my sense of ethics and morals (not to get too schmaltzy about it). Took more than a few skills and some dam' good luck as well, nature plays no favs, you are allowed to screw up *badly* on occasion.

              With that said,there are probably way more than a billion people still live close to totally feral around the planet still.

              My short report on my "research experiment": The slickest thing in civilization today, one that most folks in the developed world take for granted and don't appreciate near enough, is clean running water from the tap. Everything else is nice, electricity is swell, gadgets are fun, supermarkets rock, but clean running water is *simply great*.

            And I'd take a mammoth pair to add to my herd here, just give me year's notice so I can adjust the fencing a little better.....

            • Oh yes, Japanese culture was so harmonious before they got nuked. The occupations of Manchuria and Vietnam were happy frolics. Their soldiers just gleefully raped the Nanking Chinese as nature intended.

              Jesus, I don't know if you're deluded or an idiot.

              • by bursch-X (458146) on Thursday November 20 2008, @11:26PM (#25841891) Homepage

                Oh yes, and after the US troops went into Japan and raped the Japanese as to their liking, actually they're still raping up to this day, just look at Okinawa, where you get every other year yet another bunch of US soliders who gang rap yet another 12 year old girl there.

            • by E++99 (880734) on Thursday November 20 2008, @09:30PM (#25841153) Homepage

              Tell that to the american indians. They had a pretty harmonious culture.

              You mean the 1,000 nations with cultures based on perpetual warfare with one another, the largest of which established the largest-scale assembly-line operation of human sacrifice in recorded history, and who as a group hunted to extinction almost not only the American species of Mammoths, but nearly all the indigenous mega-fauna in the Americas? Those American Indians?

        • by sbeckstead (555647) on Thursday November 20 2008, @08:13PM (#25840603) Homepage Journal
          I feel sad at a zoo cause you can't get at the tasty ones.
    • by Farmer Tim (530755) <roundfile@@@mindless...com> on Thursday November 20 2008, @07:06PM (#25839967) Journal

      This is Slashdot; creatures with no chance of reproducing are par for the course here, I don't see why another one is so morally outrageous, especially one that's slimmer and less hairy than the average Linux hacker.