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Ionospheric Interference With GPS Signals
Posted by
kdawson
on Wed Jun 11, 2008 02:44 AM
from the trusting-your-garmin dept.
from the trusting-your-garmin dept.
Roland Piquepaille writes "In recent years, we have become increasingly dependent on applications using the Global Positioning System, such as railway control, highway traffic management, emergency response, and commercial aviation. But the American Geophysical Union warns us that we can't always trust our GPS gadgets because 'electrical activity in the... ionosphere can tamper with signals from GPS satellites.' However, new research studies are under way and 'may lead to regional predictions of reduced GPS reliability and accuracy.'" Roland's blog has useful links and a summary of a free introduction, up at the AGU site, to a special edition of the journal Space Weather with seven articles (not free) regarding ionospheric effects on GPS.
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Time to declare war? (Score:5, Funny)
Oblig. (Score:3, Funny)
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Indeed, my conspiracy theorist friend, indeed [wikipedia.org]
Dual Frequency (Score:5, Interesting)
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Ionosphere interference is reduced by using two frequencies. The higher frequency shifts less when it enters the ionosphere. Both frequencies are compared by the receive
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Re:Dual Frequency (Score:4, Informative)
Parent
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Also, it looks like military personnel ended up buying there own civilian units a large percentage of the time with obvious problems.
Looks like it was officially disabled around 2000 or so.
Re:Dual Frequency (Score:5, Interesting)
That's not to say that it was a total piece of shit. It was water-proof and pretty durable. It was really extensible; it could be plugged into a variety of other things, which made them really useful *if* you had the proper hardware. The problem was that all the needed gear to take full advantage of it required a vehicle to transport and provide power. The PLGR was a fantastic piece of gear for anyone but the infantry. Problem is, there's a hell of a lot more infantry that needs coordination on the ground than there is anyone else. So, many of us bought our own.
Parent
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Less positioning, more navigation. GPS is rapidly becoming (if it hasn't already) a level 1 navigational device (trustable on its own). Right now, it's level 2, which means it's good for general use, but must be com
Good Grief! (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Good Grief! (Score:5, Interesting)
Parent
Re:Good Grief! (Score:5, Interesting)
Parent
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Re:Good Grief! (Score:5, Interesting)
Roland has an extremely high ratio of postings and a *much* higher ratio of accepted postings. So much higher that for the longest time I figured he was a sockpuppet for one of the
The discrepancy is too large to be ignored or brushed under the carpet.
After all, the
The standards that most postings are held to would mean that *none* of Rolands postings would have been accepted, they are the very definition of blog spam.
Something is smelly here, even if I can't quite put my finger on it. Maybe it's time to do some scripting to get some real hard stats on this whole thing.
Parent
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Let me spell it out for you, I'll ignore your strawman about me not liking him 'because he's french', I don't know what prompted you to say that, it lowers the discussion level:
I wasn't trying to troll - I just couldn't think of any other reasons off the top of my head. :)
However, I must say that I don't spend a lot of time analysing the balance of quality of stories to the chance of them being accepted, so I'll have to defer to your superiour knowledge in this area
I just look at the stories, and see if I like them. I happen to be a Radio Ham, so this one is of interest to me.
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I don't like him becasue he plagiarises stories from other sites, copies them to his blog, then submits to Slashdot. He's just trying, and succeeding, in pumping up his pagerank. Originally he used to ONLY link to his blog. There were many complaints about that, eventually he started also giving the original link, but he always adds his blog link as well. He's a parasite.
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However - why shouldn't he get a little PR for supplying Slashdot with stories?
After all, we'd be moaning in hours if there weren't any stories posted.
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Every submitter gets one link, on his name. He pimps his site with the bogus "for more information" one he puts at the end (in this case the slashdot editors have, unusually, added the original link, if you compare with the firehose version.
Anyway, it's a bit like RealNetworks, there is a lot of residual mistrust after seeing how they exploited their access, and a feeling not to trust them an inch again.
After all, we'd be
Re:Good Grief! (Score:5, Funny)
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I don't want to make the Roland here, but what's your problem with Roland Pick-a-pie?
I guess Roland is just a new name for that entity Anonymous Coward that we all love and respect for its valuable contributions to our beloved slashdot. What would a day on slashdot be without goatse, first post and Roland postings
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However, if you're a Ham.... (Score:5, Interesting)
I check the "Space dials [rice.edu]" regularly, and can't wait for them to be in the red! 73s.
second amendment (Score:2, Funny)
Fortunately we have the right to bear sextants.
Now which button on this Tom Tom gives me the GHA of the first point of aries?
No Problems for me... (Score:4, Insightful)
Doesn't cause any problems for me. Sometimes I've got just a few feet of accuracy in my position, other times it's 10's of feet. I guess it would cause issues with my home-made cruise missle, though...
Aviation has used VOR navigation for decades, developed during WWII. And the US Government has a big OFF switch for that, too. Part of pilot training is knowing how to navigate when all the fancy gadgets are offline. Because you never know when a system will fail.
I just view this as a confirmation of what I've noticed before: that sometimes the signals aren't as good as others. Fortunately, I have a computer that is capable of recognizing the situation and performing the necessary error correction on the fly. I call it my brain.
Hence WAAS (Score:3, Insightful)
In geocaching, the greater the accuracy the better. For car navigation, you don't even need it, as the accuracy is better than the width of a road regardless!
This article seems to be a decade behind... -Randy
GPS designers already working on this (Score:2)
Differential GPS (Score:2)
For various reasons (including this one), people have come up with ways to enhance the accuracy of GPS.
I've used differential GPS for several applications. Terrestrial beacon stations listen to GPS, and compare where they know they are with where GPS says they are. They broadcast these corrections and anybody in the vicinity can use them.
WAAS is a similar concept. I've played with it too.
...laura
Roland the Plogger, again (Score:3, Informative)
First, it's a Roland the Plogger story, so it's going to be wrong.
GPS accuracy is a serious problem for users who need high precision. More applications are assuming that GPS is precise to a few meters, which, often, it isn't. It's always good enough if you just need to find an airport. Below that level, error can be a problem.
Local high-precision systems, like GPS-based systems for landing, use a pseudolite, a receiver on the ground in a known location that receives GPS and broadcasts small corrections. The pseudolite is usually located near the end of the active runway, so as aircraft get closer to the runway, the error approaches zero. There's a similar setup for "precision farming", where the tractor precision is precisely known but there's a psuedolite at the side of the field.
Without a pseudolite, it's harder. Part of the problem is that there aren't enough satellites. To get a GPS lat/long fix, you need to see at least three sats. To get lat/log/elevation, you need to see four. For high-precision work (down to 15cm), you need five, plus correction signals from receiving stations (see Omnistar) that are monitoring propagation. You're lucky to see four in a built-up area, because you can only see part of the sky. If you can see five, you can measure error. Some systems use both GPS and GLONASS sats; now that Russia is building up the GLONASS constellation again, this works better. By 2009, the GLONASS constellation should be fully populated, and systems that use both GPS and GLONASS will have a better chance of seeing five sats.
Propagation problems always add delay; they never subtract from it. Propagation problems come from what the ionosphere is doing, and from reflections from big metal surfaces like buildings. In urban canyons, you're seeing mostly bounces.
This is an issue for civilian uses that assume the system has more precision than it really does. Car navigation systems that try to tell whether a car is on a freeway or an adjacent side street from GPS data alone are likely to have problems. The same problem applies to GPS systems for railroad signalling (these make me nervous) which try to tell on which track a train is running.
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This is a misleading statement, because it depends on the model of receiver you're using. Some newer receivers, for example, use the two GPS signals -- military and civilian -- to resolve ionospheric interference. You don't actually need to decrypt the military signal, you just have to be able to receive it. Then the receiver can adjust for the ionosphere's activity and give you a highly accurate signal.
railway control? (Score:3, Funny)
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But at least you knew the transmission was scrambled since the data failed to align with the required protocol (e.g. a bad checksum, no magic number, etc.). I think this is what the OP was referring to. If you can get any data from the transmission after the signal has been processed, it's highly likely that its good data.
Re:GPS is digital! (Score:4, Insightful)
Parent
Re:GPS is digital! (Score:5, Interesting)
So you might hear the tune fine, but if the ionosphere delays the tune every so slightly, your reading will be off and your position will be inaccurate.
Parent
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Aviation can go both ways, but planes do come with altimeters.
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Interestingly enough, also, you need to take relativistic distortion into account. General relativity speeds up the atomic clocks (due to less gravity) and special relativity slows down the clocks (due to their velocity); add them together, and the clocks run about 28 microseconds slower than they would sitting beside you on Earth.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Differential_GPS [wikipedia.org]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waas [wikipedia.org]
Re:GPS is digital! (Score:5, Informative)
Just receiving a digital signal doesn't mean its right!
Parent
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Why not just calculate based on the reported velocity of the vehicle, 'pinging' satellites every minute or so and simply dropping anything that puts you in Antarctica?
Trains? Anything that puts a train a certain distance off the track could be dropped. The acceptable values would have to be manually defined, however. Results could also be checked against reports from evenly-spaced receiver towers, with each train constantly broa
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Why not just calculate based on the reported velocity of the vehicle, 'pinging' satellites every minute or so and simply dropping anything that puts you in Antarctica?
Because that is not what happens. TFA (and the F does _not_ stand for "fine" in this case) claims that "your GPS cannot be trusted". It can. Ionospheric interference has been well known since the initial design of GPS. It is one of several factors that introduce a few meters of inaccuracy into the GPS in your TomTom, and all these factors add up to about ten meters of inaccuracy. It doesn't put you into Antarctica - and since your GPS calculates a four-dimensional position (x, y, z and time), the chances t
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