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NASA Fires Astronaut

Posted by samzenpus on Wed Mar 07, 2007 06:49 PM
from the were-the-diapers-too-much dept.
NASA Space News
davidwr writes "In an unprecedented move for an unprecedented situation, NASA has fired now-former astronaut Lisa Nowack. She is facing charges of attempted kidnapping related to an incident earlier this year. Ms. Nowack is a Navy officer and remains so."
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  • Has anyone tried (Score:4, Funny)

    by Normal Dan (1053064) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @06:52PM (#18269462)
    listening to her side of the story?

    • Re:Has anyone tried (Score:5, Funny)

      by Brett Buck (811747) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @06:56PM (#18269542)
      Yes, I agree. I would certainly like to know the perfectly rational reason for driving 900 miles in diapers, and then tracking down and pepper-spraying someone you have never met, in an airport parking lot.

              Brett
      • That "someone" put her through a lot of needless emotional pain. Perhpas that "someone" will now think twice before so carelessly hurting others, thus making this world a better place for all. Some might even say Lisa is a hero among heros.

        As for the diapers. Well, that is so you can drive non stop. Duh.

        See? It is all perfectly rational.

      • Re:Has anyone tried (Score:4, Insightful)

        by natet (158905) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @09:39PM (#18271360)

        Yes, I agree. I would certainly like to know the perfectly rational reason for driving 900 miles in diapers, and then tracking down and pepper-spraying someone you have never met, in an airport parking lot.

        Too much has been made of the diaper thing. To us non-astronaut types, wearing the diapers is kind of crazy, but it is a trick astronauts use when they go on space walks and such when needing to use the bathroom is inconvenient if not impossible. That part isn't crazy IMHO. The rest of it? Yah, totally wacko. I was under the impression she knew the other person though. I could have been misinformed though.

        • Re:Has anyone tried (Score:5, Informative)

          by mclearn (86140) on Thursday March 08 2007, @12:48AM (#18272808) Homepage
          Hell, most female paragliders wear diapers when performing long cross-country flights especially in competitive or hostile environments when landing for bathroom breaks is not an option. Most guys tend to perform "high altitude irrigation" -- it's easier to perform when you can angle the flow.

    • Re:Has anyone tried (Score:5, Insightful)

      by susano_otter (123650) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @06:57PM (#18269566) Homepage
      I'm sure many people have... including the mental health professionals responsible for certifying that the astronauts are maintaining the presence of mind and emotional stability necessary to perform what is a very demanding, stressful, and risky job.

      I'd imagine that it takes very little in the way of strange behavior to disqualify a person for astronaut duty, regardless of what their explanation is. Even if her behavior was totally justified and not in any way her fault, the fact that she ended up behaving this way probably means she's not good astronaut material anymore. Astronauts should generally not respond to environmental or emotional stress by flipping out and committing crimes.
    • Oefelein told investigators he and Nowak both served on the bicycling team at NASA and had been involved in a sexual relationship for some time. He said he met Shipman in November 2006 while he was involved in pre-launch training at Kennedy Space Center. In January 2007, Oefelein said, he told Nowak he wanted to date Shipman "exclusively."

      Even if Oefelein handled things poorly or strung her along a bit (I'm not asserting that he did this)her reaction still made her unfit to be an astronaut. She reacts unp

      • Re:Has anyone tried (Score:4, Insightful)

        by flyingsquid (813711) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @08:06PM (#18270368)
        What about him? If what you quote is true, then he didn't just handle things poorly, he handled things unprofessionally. He gets involved with a married woman at work at then ditches her for another woman he meets at work? It is almost always a bad idea to get involved with people you need to have a working relationship with... to say nothing of people you might have to work with 100 miles above the earth.

        His career is probably shot at this point. They won't fire him- it would draw yet more unwanted attention to NASA, and he might make false accusations (or worse, true ones) about NASA's own failures (for instance, that NASA turned a blind eye to this kind of behavior). But NASA might issue a strong reprimand, and make it clear that they would do everything in their power to make his transition to a non-NASA career as quick and painless as possible. I doubt he will ever fly again- there would be too much negative publicity. If they ever put him on a shuttle, the mission would get more publicity from rude jokes by Leno and Letterman than any of the actual science would.

        • Re:Has anyone tried (Score:4, Insightful)

          by IgnoramusMaximus (692000) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @09:04PM (#18271032)

          What about him?

          I think he is done too. This will bring all the attention of NASA evaluators on him. Not to mention that them both being Navy officers renders their activities in direct violation of all the various rules of professional conduct which officers must adhere to. I am quite certain that adultery is frowned upon in those.

          So I would expect his/her court martials and/or dishonorable discharges to be just around the corner. It just so happens that her truly outre ways are hogging all the news at the moment. His moment in the spotlight is coming.

    • Yeah, I've tried, but thats not the question. (Score:5, Insightful)

      by deft (253558) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @07:20PM (#18269872) Homepage
      "Has anyone tried listening to her side of the story?"

      has anyone tried to listen to it without laughing... thats the hard part.

      What I love about this story is she gets aaa wig, everything you need to kill and torture someone, drives forever to meet her... and the weird part is diapers that isnt weird for her or her job... like none of that other stuff bothers anyone.

      Clearly, we are desensitized to murder and all that... but adult diapers really gets us.

      • Re:Yeah, I've tried, but thats not the question. (Score:5, Insightful)

        by Chris Burke (6130) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @08:22PM (#18270580) Homepage
        Because any human with a heart can at least understand the jealous lover who decides to take out the competition even if we'd never actually do it. That's a story as ancient as mankind, something which outside of the immediacy is completely banal.

        The diapers are what make it weird.

        Of course the rest bothers lots of people, it just doesn't make you stop and go "huh?" like hearing she drove cross country wearing diapers does.

      • Re:Has anyone tried (Score:5, Funny)

        by sehlat (180760) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @07:19PM (#18269860)
        Minimum sanity standards for officers? Good Lord, man, why not minimum sanity standards for the Commander in Chief?

        Oh, wait...

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by mi (197448)

        I'm sure to want to hear about the benefits of driving in diapers.

        This part has been explained in the very first news article on the subject. You want to wear diapers, when you can not (or don't want to) be interrupted. Apparently, astronauts wear diapers at launch/re-entry. It is a good idea, because you may spend a while strapped to a chair.

        She wanted to get over 900 miles as quickly as possible — without stopping to pee — strapped to the driver seat. This part of her act is not at all cra

      • I'm sure she can become a professional pundit:

        "You know, Larry, before I went completely blitzo, drove 900 miles in diapers to kill my would-be boyfriend's love interest, I too believed that Mormons didn't buy nearly enough Elton John records."

      • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

        by deltacephei (842219)
        Not disagreeing with you, but a definite issue is the large size of the astronaut core overall. Why have so many people, at very high cost, been accepted and trained only to then wait for years for their number to come up and the chance to participate in a mission? It's not unreasonable to think that a smaller group would be easier to monitor for social problems, and correspondingly decrease the probability of something like this happening. If NASA has invested thousands (millions?) per person in trainin

      • You're forgetting... astronauts = military (Score:4, Informative)

        by Chmcginn (201645) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @10:42PM (#18271914) Journal

        I'd figure with cases like this, they'd just keep her suspended without pay pending the outcome of the trial.

        This can't be done, legally, because Capt. Nowak is a military officer. (As it says in the article, the reason NASA requested her transfer back the regular Navy is because they do not have the authority to use administrative measures against military members assigned to them.

        Firing her sounds like NASA is taking a stand in what is probably an ongoing investigation . . .

        This is actually pretty common in all things military. It doesn't take conviction of anything to remove an officer or enlisted person from a special position, like a commanding officer, executive officer, command representative, or even just a normal pilot. Even just being charged with something questionable usually results in the person being relieved of that position/command until the whole issue is sorted out. If they're found innocent, they might get another chance at it sometime later...

  • nah (Score:4, Funny)

    by User 956 (568564) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @06:52PM (#18269468) Homepage
    In an unprecedented move for an unprecedented situation, NASA has fired now-former astronaut Lisa Nowack.

    It's not completely unprecedented. They fired the Challenger crew. I guess they just couldn't keep it together.

  • Unprecedented? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by susano_otter (123650) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @06:53PM (#18269496) Homepage
    Okay, I guess technically they've never fired an astronaut before, so it is "unprecedented" in that sense.

    But it's not like it's unusual to fire someone who is incapable of doing the job you hired them to do.

    Sensationalism at its "finest".
    • Getting fired from the Federal Government is generally tough-especially if you are prior military. Unlike private industry, it requires TONS of paperwork, and/or an extraordinary event. You have to really fuck up to get canned. Typically, the way to deal with a problem employee is to promote them into another department or position-that is usually how it is done. This is one reason why the Federal Government has some seriously mismatched people in certain positions. Also, the closer you are to retireme

      • Re:Not necessarily... (Score:4, Informative)

        by josecanuc (91) * on Wednesday March 07 2007, @09:03PM (#18271018) Homepage Journal

        Getting fired from the Federal Government is generally tough-especially if you are prior military.

        To be sure, she isn't "prior military". She is a current Navy officer formerly on assignment to NASA. As far as paperwork goes, she is just reassigned out of NASA, since the Navy is still her administrator and she hasn't been discharged (yet).

  • Diapers saving time? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by lothar97 (768215) * <owenNO@SPAMsmigelski.org> on Wednesday March 07 2007, @06:54PM (#18269504) Homepage Journal
    One question about this whole thing that has bothered me is that she wore diapers to obviate the need for bathroom breaks. She drove 900 miles really fast, which meant she also had to refuel. Assuming great mileage, a large fuel tank, and a speedy car, she had to stop at least twice to gas. I'm not sure how much time would've been saved by stopping off in the loo. I think it tends to show more of how batty she is- which is good for her defense. Has anyone seen how long the trip actually took for her to drive?

    • Re:Diapers saving time? (Score:5, Funny)

      by Astral Jung (450195) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @06:59PM (#18269586) Homepage
      Apparently, you've not seen very many gas station restrooms.

    • Re:Diapers saving time? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by GreyPoopon (411036) <gpoopon AT gmail DOT com> on Wednesday March 07 2007, @07:09PM (#18269714)

      One question about this whole thing that has bothered me is that she wore diapers to obviate the need for bathroom breaks.

      Although we can't be sure, I would guess that it was not to avoid wasting time, and was instead to avoid getting caught on camera. You can fill up your gas tank outside, but most gas stations these days have their WCs on the inside, and most of them have CCTV to take pretty pictures of you. If she was hoping to murder and dispose of her rival, she would absolutely not want any evidence that she had made a cross country trip around the time that the victim disappeared. Of course, most gas stations these days also have cameras watching the license plates of their customers to avoid drive-offs, but I guess she was improving her chances by not going inside.
      • Do you know that she in fact stopped at a gas station? If it were me I'd take my gas in cans in the trunk. I've got my gas with me, I've got my diapers. I haven't seen anywhere that she stopped at a gas station, or that she didn't just carry extra gas with her in the trunk.

        Maybe she was a backwoods hiker and thought of the trick of pre-placed cans of gas along the highway where she could grab them later. Good lord, it's not hard to be a criminal genius.

    • Re:Diapers saving time? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by iamacat (583406) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @07:19PM (#18269866)
      How do you think astronauts handle descent in landing capsules, long spacewalks or other situation where one might need to pee? What's bizarre to us, might be routine for people who go on unusual missions.

      • Re:Diapers saving time? (Score:4, Informative)

        by couchslug (175151) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @08:28PM (#18270660)
        Or "usual" missions.
        Ask any 18-wheeler driver if they use a "piss jug"! When you are stuck in traffic, or have valuable cargo, or don't want to stop in a bad neighborhood, a plastic jug solves problems nicely.

        • Re:Diapers saving time? (Score:5, Funny)

          by Marko DeBeeste (761376) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @07:25PM (#18269924)
          Hadn't heard about the soiled part. My thought is some kind of organic brain problem (stroke, tumor, etc.) She profile's out as too smart and confident a person with a robust history. In terms of cognitive (in this case delusional) issues, the best predictor of what will happen is what has happened.

          Either that or the guy is hung like a coal-mine mule.

        • took about 10 minutes to pee

          Say what?! I don't take 10 minutes to lay a cable, never mind take a leak. Seriously, if your bladder was so large that you needed 10 minutes to empty it (including all the attendant activity) you could easily drive for 10 hours without having to stop. I've gone seven hours and 1.2L of water before it became a case of "Next rest stop, or a tree!", and that stop was still well below 10 minutes.

          Your calculations may be being generous, to be sure, but 10 minutes is excessive.

  • Why is this odd? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by LordPhantom (763327) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @06:57PM (#18269552)
    It's not like this is strange. She's under investigation for a felony... I'm pretty sure that disqualifies her from flying on the space shuttle. If not that, the fact that she's a certifiable whackjob.

    As for her remaining a Navy officer, I suspect she'll get a second (please forgive the pun here) dishonorable discharge after the dust settles.

    • Re:Why is this odd? (Score:5, Informative)

      by nofx911 (634100) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @07:09PM (#18269716) Homepage
      According to NASA the felony investigation is only a fraction of the problem. She is technically on lone from the Navy - which means that she is only allowed to work in certain roles that the Navy has pre-authorized for her. Since she can not participate in those roles, due to her current legal obligations (shes not allowed outside of Houston), there is nothing that she can do within NASA. Henceforth, NASA has no choice other than releasing her.

  • NASA's shuttle replacement? (Score:4, Funny)

    by dacut (243842) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @07:09PM (#18269720)
    Oefelein told investigators he and Nowak both served on the bicycling team at NASA... Man, I know NASA is strapped for cash, but bicycles?

    • Not just any bicycles (Score:5, Funny)

      by patio11 (857072) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @07:59PM (#18270268)
      They're custom-made from Lockheed Martin, spent 8 years in development each at a cost of $650 million, use military-grade titanium frames and have wheels made up of 65,000 tiny sheets of vulcanized rubber which are handmade and then painstakingly knit together to best resist wear-and-tear with the road. They're only used for serious scientific business, like carrying a mouse in the basket to see what the physiological changes are to a mouse riding a bicycle. It was determined that the changes are rather similar to what a mouse experiences in low-gravity: not much, and if you give him cheese he really couldn't care less.

      Plans to retest using a hamster and sunflower seeds were scrapped after the bike was totaled in a training accident. (A NASA bicycle rider on loan from the Air Force attempted to take the bicycle over a 3 inch curb, which should have been within the 5 inch tolerance level of the suspension. Unfortunately, one of NASA's subcontractors designed for 5 cm tolerance level instead, and after the suspension exceeded tolerance it folded like only a $600 million can can.)

      NASA is now submitting a proposal for a better, more expensive bicycle to continue their important scientific mission. $1 billion is slated for testing the suspension under a variety of stressful conditions, and as much as $2.50 is slated for experimental apparati for measuring the responses of the hamster.

  • Pampers, bitches. (Score:5, Funny)

    by LibertineR (591918) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @08:11PM (#18270426)
    The chick was sporting Pampers when NASA officially endorses Depends.

    She had to go. Were it the NBA, they could have just fined her, or sent her to rehab, but.....

  • A different perspective (Score:3, Insightful)

    by iamthird (998498) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @10:17PM (#18271738)
    Let's remember that Lisa Nowak is a human being, even though she acted abnormally. I am not defending her wrong actions, but I would just like to say: people, don't be too harsh on her. She has family, friends, and a future (however it may be) just like the rest of us.

    Imagine one of your friends or family member did something like she did. You can't really imagine it, right? That's what her friends and family now face, because she has done something so incredibly unbelievable.

    It's a great sadness and tragedy to her family and friends, NASA, the world space program, and most of all, Lisa Nowak herself.

    Let's hope she and NASA will learn from this lesson and wish that she will still have some hope for her future.

    • Re:tossed out an airlock (Score:5, Insightful)

      by susano_otter (123650) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @07:09PM (#18269730) Homepage
      So you're saying that NASA should keep someone totally unqualified for any kind of high-stress, high-risk work on the payroll?

      Besides, it's more like she's a Navy pilot seconded to the National Aeronautics and Space Administration for space research projects. If she's no longer suited to work on such projects, the right thing to do is to take her off those projects and return her to her regular Navy pilot duties--or such of those duties as her parent organization finds her still fit to perform. It's not like NASA tossed her out on the street.

      Also, this is the first time an Astronaut has "snapped" like this. How do you know it's the training program, and not a personality quirk in the candidate? Astronauts are typically chosen from among a pool of people who have already proven their aptitude for high-stress, high-risk work. Most of the candidates eithe wash out or pass through the qualification tests. The ones that pass through almost never snap, but as manning increases, the occasional ringer is bound to slip through. The right thing to do is not to keep the ringer, but to wash them out as soon as you become aware of them.

      • Re:tossed out an airlock (Score:5, Informative)

        by TubeSteak (669689) on Wednesday March 07 2007, @07:26PM (#18269944) Journal

        Besides, it's more like she's a Navy pilot seconded to the National Aeronautics and Space Administration for space research projects. If she's no longer suited to work on such projects, the right thing to do is to take her off those projects and return her to her regular Navy pilot duties
        FTFA:
        NASA said it requested Nowak's detail be ended "because the agency lacks the administrative means to deal appropriately with the criminal charges pending against Nowak. Because Nowak is a naval officer on assignment to NASA, rather than a NASA civil servant, she is not subject to administrative action by NASA."

        In other words, NASA's only option (other than doing nothing) is to fire her.

        As for the quality of people NASA takes into their program, they're mostly products of the Navy/Army Test Pilot School. Even the engineers (like this crazy robotic arm operator) went to test pilot school.

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