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Flexible Body Armor

Posted by ScuttleMonkey on Sat Feb 18, 2006 01:47 PM
from the hard-designs dept.
Science Technology
dotmax writes "One item to pop out of the Turin Winter Olympics is the use of flexible body armor. Similar to silly putty, this shear rate material is flexible under normal load and hardens under impact. Sounds expensive, but could offer some great alternatives for traditional hard shelled impact gear in active sports and military applications."
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[+] Military Develops Liquid Body Armor 688 comments
kai5263499 writes "Military.com has an article about a new liquid body armor the U.S. Army Research Laboratory has developed. According to Dr. Eric Wetzel, the project coordinator: 'The key component of liquid armor is a shear thickening fluid. STF is composed of hard particles suspended in a liquid. The liquid, polyethylene glycol, is non-toxic, and can withstand a wide range of temperatures. Hard, nano-particles of silica are the other components of STF. This combination of flowable and hard components results in a material with unusual properties'."
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  • Meh... Color me unimpressed. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by XorNand (517466) * on Saturday February 18 2006, @01:48PM (#14750541)
    Skiwear company Spyder, based in Colorado, US, developed racing suits incorporating d3o along the shins and forearms and offered members of the US and Canadian Olympic alpine ski teams the chance to try them out several months ago. "Now they love it and won't ski without it," claims Richard Palmer, CEO of UK-based d3o Labs, which developed the material.
    I don't get it. What's the advantage of using flexible armor on body parts that don't flex? If it works as advertised, seems like this product would be more useful on the torso, back, neck, or near joints. Maybe I'm just jaded, but I'd bet that the skiers really couldn't care less about it. The CEO, on the other hand, now gets to brag about his new technology being used in the Olympics. Cycling and golf is full of this type of crap--technology and jargon used more as a marketing tool than to really enhance the product's performance.
    • What's the advantage of using flexible armor on body parts that don't flex?

      Try telling a downhill skiier crashing into a wall at over 100 MPH that there are body parts that don't flex. I'm sure they'll happily believe you and give up their armor.

      • Re:Meh... Color me unimpressed. (Score:4, Insightful)

        by Kelbear (870538) on Saturday February 18 2006, @02:05PM (#14750656)
        Please don't think I'm trying to be mean here. Assume a friendly tone:P

        But I don't quite follow. The grandparent poster was skeptical about the value of flexible armor over parts that should never bend. If your shin is bending significantly, your shin's probably broken.

        Flexible armor is useful over flexing parts of your body so that you can get maximum utility. Like a flexible elbow pad, it'd let you bend your elbow easier and more powerfully. But over your non-bending shin, you'd just want the strongest protection possible here right? Shouldn't be any cases where your shin is bending.
        • A shin may be rigid, but it sits between two joints. Any movement in those joints will jostle the armor over the shin. Also, a shin is backed by a great big muscle that moves around quite a bit. Both factors will make wearing rigid armor annoying.

        • Re:Meh... Color me unimpressed. (Score:5, Informative)

          by Scarblac (122480) <slashdot@gerlich.nl> on Saturday February 18 2006, @03:09PM (#14751013) Homepage

          But I don't quite follow. The grandparent poster was skeptical about the value of flexible armor over parts that should never bend. If your shin is bending significantly, your shin's probably broken.

          Close your left hand over your right lower arm. Now turn move your hand left and right, up and down, flex the muscles... that thing moves a lot. The shin likewise has muscles and two bones in it. Apparently the sporters like this flexible thing better than rigid protectors, so it seems to help.

          Why the poster calls this "body armor" i'm not sure though, according to TFA this is purely about shin and arm protection, the areas that get into contact with the sticks during slalom skiing.

          • Re:Meh... Color me unimpressed. (Score:4, Informative)

            by MindStalker (22827) <jlarsen@NOSpam.fsu.edu> on Saturday February 18 2006, @03:15PM (#14751041) Journal
            Well PopSci also had an article about it (the print version, it should be on the web version in a few days). Apparently they are putting it into helmets it allows for a flexable beanie type hat to become a hardhat when nessesary. According to the article it wouldn't be good enough for a motocycle helmet but would be perfect for speeds skating for example.

        • Re:Meh... Color me unimpressed. (Score:4, Insightful)

          by YrWrstNtmr (564987) on Saturday February 18 2006, @03:32PM (#14751126)
          But I don't quite follow. The grandparent poster was skeptical about the value of flexible armor over parts that should never bend. If your shin is bending significantly, your shin's probably broken.

          Consider putting it over your upper arm. Your bicep flexes, the bone underneath does not. But if you've ever hit a gate at high speed, you'd LOVE some armor over your upper arm.
          A rigid plate works, but is much harder to work with. A flexible plate, that moves as your muscles contract, would be a lot better.

          Your tibia doesn't flex (a lot), but the skin and muscle between the bone and the outside world does.


      • Try telling a downhill skiier crashing into a wall at over 100 MPH that there are body parts that don't flex.
        I doubt this stuff is going to have much protection against hitting a wall at 100MPH. The article says that racers are using this stuff on their arms and legs to protect against hitting the poles. I'm sure without protection hitting those poles as hard as they do is going to hurt like hell. If you hit a wall at 100mph, no amount of body armour is going to save you, as all your internal organs are
        • yeh but those areas have muscles don't they? flexible armor would be better than hard armor in allowing the muscles more freedom to move while flexing without needing to the make the hard armor loose right? the bone of my shin is just a narrow part of my leg, and my forearm isn't a column of calcium either. doesn't the rest of it need protection too?
    • What's the advantage of using flexible armor on body parts that don't flex?

      Having rigid plates even on parts of the body that flex less is bulky and cumbersome. Flexible armour is a great concept - far less noticable in normal conditions than some of the rigid ski body armour solutions e.g. Dainese [snowboard-asylum.com]

      BTW For the pseudo science and some nice pictures of 'molecules' see the 3DO website [d3olab.com]

    • Re:Meh... Color me unimpressed. (Score:5, Insightful)

      by rahvin112 (446269) on Saturday February 18 2006, @02:08PM (#14750674)
      There are advantages to having something flexible against your skin that will harden on impact. One of those is comfort. Hard plastic guards aren't comfortable and are very obvious (and more than likely hurt aerodynamics). In addition the forearms have muscles on them which if you use your muscles at all tend to flex and expand. Having a flexible soft guard on those body parts would be incredible.

    • Re:Meh... Color me unimpressed. (Score:5, Interesting)

      by dogugotw (635657) on Saturday February 18 2006, @02:08PM (#14750675)
      Ever wear shin pads or arm protectors? Ever notice that they need to be strapped on and chafe like a SOB? I'd love to get my hands on something like this. Built into an undersuit, moves with you, no staps, lightweight and instant protection when you hit something. I'd like to know that my non-moving bones (shins, radius/ulna, skull) were wrapped in protection when the jerk in an SUV cuts in front of my motorcycle and takes me down.

      FWIW, this stuff sounds like what happens to a semi-liquid mix of cornstarch and water. Slide your hand in and it drops into the fluid; hit it hard and no penetration at all.

    • Have you ever had a rigid shin guard strapped to your leg. If you have, you realize that after a short time, it starts to abraid your leg, because while your shin bone itself is not stretching and deforming, the skin around it is constantly moving. It's particularly obvious in the old rollerblades with the plastic tops that would strap over your shins. If the material can flow some, that means that not only will it be a close to perfect fit, but if it happens to shift off of your leg because you've jogge
    • Having non-flexable armor, even on non-flexing parts of the body, allows for faster and easier movement. Think about it, a space suit has flexable material at every human joint, but it is still a pain to manuver in.

    • I used to ski race as a kid... (Score:5, Informative)

      by tetromino (807969) on Saturday February 18 2006, @02:58PM (#14750959)
      ...and frankly, this flexible armor sounds great. The reason you want some kind of protection is that you (sometimes in speed events, very often in slalom) run into gates (the plastic poles stuck in the snow that you have to turn around) with various parts of your body. Since you are going fast, and you are wearing a thin aerodynamic racing suit, it hurts like hell. So, if you don't feel like getting hurt, you strap on some plastic shin and arm guards, sort of like an Ancient Greek warrior with his greaves. Anyway, these plastic guards really are not the ideal solution. They chafe (since you are strapping them on tight, and the muscles and skin under the straps are constantly moving). They limit your motions quite a bit. They are, frankly, uncomfortable. And if you are doing speed events, they kill your aerodynamics.

      So, as far as I am concerned, flexible armor is totally the way to go. Hopefully FIS won't ban it.
  • Since it only hardens on impact, could it also be used in hand weaponry?

    "Honest, officer, we just came across him and he was beaten to a pulp. You can search us, go ahead, we ain't got nothin' but our gym towels..."

  • impressive? (Score:4, Funny)

    by d34thm0nk3y (653414) on Saturday February 18 2006, @01:51PM (#14750552)
    I might be impressed, but only if it uses a Holtzman Fields somehow....
  • any particular reason these suits vaguely resemble that of spiderman's?
    could this be some geek-inventor's (redundant, i know) idea of making his childhood dream of being a superhero come true?

    • any particular reason these suits vaguely resemble that of spiderman's?
      From TFA:
      Skiwear company Spyder, based in Colorado, US, developed racing suits incorporating d3o along the shins and forearms...

  • "Good jib Jimbo!" *slap* (Score:5, Funny)

    by 88NoSoup4U88 (721233) on Saturday February 18 2006, @01:53PM (#14750568) Homepage
    Hehe, I guess they shouldn't be giving anyone wearing this a slap on the shoulder after a win: He/She will instantly be packaged in a concrete cocoon!*

    *Disclaimer: May be exaggerated

  • Not for military really.. except maybe supplement (Score:4, Insightful)

    by luvirini (753157) on Saturday February 18 2006, @01:53PM (#14750571)
    The things that happen when struck by a bullet or shrapnel are different than a skier hitting the ground. This material could perhaps help to make the impact plates, but the actual stopping of the penetration will likely need "normal means"

  • Spy cameras? (Score:5, Funny)

    by eMartin (210973) on Saturday February 18 2006, @01:53PM (#14750572)
    Now when spies want to copy documents, they can just tear off a piece of their armor and press it against the pages.

  • Viagra Replacement? (Score:5, Funny)

    by Jelloman (69747) on Saturday February 18 2006, @01:54PM (#14750579)
    In other news, 98% of women polled can't wait until they start making condoms out of this stuff.
  • But Phil Green, research director at d3o Labs, says it is difficult to precisely measure the material's properties because the hardening effect only last as long as the impact itself.

    Certainly a researcher could take a sample of this material and strike it with increasing force using a material with known hardness. That might get them an answer beyond: "we don't know." I'm skeptical of this material's utility in a military application. Particularly as body armor against high velocity bullets and shrapnel. Woven carbon and Kevlar seem still unmatched in its capacity to take a high impact round. But, like I said, an assault riffle and a material sample could answer that question in minutes...
    • That is why the statement is like that.. they do not want to know how crappy their product it.
    • How about using it in hard hats or safety boots (currently steel toed)

      There's a lot of applications for this type of material

      Woven carbon and Kevlar seem still unmatched in its capacity to take a high impact round.

      But I don't think it'll replace Kevlar & carbon fiber.

      Even the Army's current Kevlar helmets won't actually stop any military rounds. If you're lucky, the bullet will come in at an angle and get deflected, but that's about all the use those heavy helmets are good for. Deflecting bullets and wo

    • I agree completely. And I doubt this would be a replacement for typical body armor. But, if this material works, why not make the BDU out of it? Make it a supplement to normal armor, not a replacement, and you end up with a little extra protection and benefit with no loss of flexibility and no increased weight. Seems like a win win except possibly for the cost. Granted this doesn't take into account other issues such as surviving the wear and tear a BDU will go through in its lifespan, etc... But it c
    • The strain rate hardening effect is velocity dependent but also requires time. As body armour is wouldn't be fast enough to stop a bullet. Hence it hasn't been used yet in military armour. It could be developed to have been ballistic properties. For example using it in conjunction with kevlar/ceramic armour might allow for lighter more flexible armour. There's probably a whole lot of development needed before that happens. It might be useful for other applications such as light armour to stop knives, clubs

  • Iain M. Banks (Score:5, Funny)

    by F34nor (321515) * on Saturday February 18 2006, @01:56PM (#14750592)
    Sounds like gel suit armor. Let's hope you like your suits personality.

  • Could be great for inline skating, etc (Score:5, Insightful)

    by JRock911 (848012) on Saturday February 18 2006, @02:05PM (#14750653)
    I do a lot of inline skating and I can see where this stuff could be revolutionary for outdoor inlining, skateboarding, etc.

    Personally, I don't wear pads because they're uncomfortable. I do wear a helmet and palm sliders, which are supposed to help keep your palms from getting skinned up in an actual fall by serving as a buffer between your palms and the asphalt. In theory, they work pretty good. When you fall going upwards of 30MPH, they aren't a lot of help. Once you hit the ground, even if you initially brace with your palms, momentum is pretty much going to send you wherever it wants.

    Being able to wear a long sleeved shirt or pants made of this stuff to help protect the knees and elbows would be huge. I have a road rash spot on my elbow now from a fall last weekend. Granted I don't fall much.. that was the first time in over a year I've had a crash and it was a very minor crash but even still, I'd probably wear this stuff for safety if it was available and not terribly bulky. Most inliners who are serious wear skin suits or jerseys so substituting this stuff would pretty much have no downsides as long as, like I said, it wasn't too bulky.

    On the flip side, most skateboarders want to look "extreme" so this stuff might not be a huge hit with them. I personally like my skin intact, however.

  • Sounds like non-Newtonian fluid (Score:5, Informative)

    by Meostro (788797) on Saturday February 18 2006, @02:05PM (#14750655) Homepage Journal
    Looks like they use a Non-Newtonian fluid [wikipedia.org], that's the type of material that has these properties.

    This was one of the cooler demonstration in my HS chemistry class, the teacher made up a big batch of water + corn starch, and was playing with it like mud, squishing it around and whatnot. Then he beat the hell out of it, and it just sat there and didn't splash, it looked (and sounded) like it was a solid sheet. It was odd to see something that was very dynamic under low force, but static under high force.

    It's like a seatbelt, if you yank it hard it locks up, but if you pull gently it will extend.

    • Re:Sounds like non-Newtonian fluid (Score:5, Informative)

      by MustardMan (52102) on Saturday February 18 2006, @02:15PM (#14750711)
      There's an entire field that deals with studying the properties of these and similar "weird" materials. It's called soft condensed matter. It happens to be the field in which I'm currently working ;)

      Corn starch is the standard example almost everyone uses when trying to describe our field to laymen. The other one we use a lot is the term "squishy physics", but that one sometimes gets us mocked by the ignorant who think "nuclear physics" is for smart people and "squishy physics" is for the dumbasses.
  • It seems to have the same properties to custard powder, so it you want to know what its like you can play with it yourself... it does sound like a more practicle set up though, also if it could stop a bullet it would be useful to put under body armour (and could go over the head)... the only problem is the impact which would break all the bones in that area... hmm, could even be worse than a through and through...

    anywho, about the custard, if you mix custard powder with water (I'm not sure of exact quant

  • powdered glass (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Russ Nelson (33911) on Saturday February 18 2006, @02:07PM (#14750669) Homepage
    The original bullet-resistant vest was flexible. It was made of powdered glass, flexible until hit hard, at which point it would stiffen up and spread the force of the impact.
    -russ
  • "Similar to silly putty"

    If it were more like Flubber (if you remember this you are an old geek) the projectiles would bounce back at the source.
  • Louis Wu unavailable for comment.

  • ...just pick out your favorite newspaper cartoon, press the armor on it, and presto! You're riding into battle with your favorite character. Forget "Death From Above". Nothing says combat like Peanuts or Foxtrot.

  • Very useful (Score:3, Funny)

    by xeeazgk (850506) on Saturday February 18 2006, @03:04PM (#14750987)
    I want to get all my underwear made out of this stuff. That way I'll never have to wear a cup for sports.

    It would also help for when I want to be impertinent to feminists.

  • Getting the wrong impression (Score:5, Insightful)

    by wrook (134116) on Saturday February 18 2006, @03:33PM (#14751129) Homepage
    I think people are getting the wrong impression here. This is put into suits for slalom and super G athletes. It's not to protect you from a fall, but to protect you from the flags that whip you when you go around them. It's not going to save you when you crash into a tree. It's going to stop you from getting bruises on your arms and legs when you hit the flags.

    Cool idea. But probably not particularly practical in other applications (maybe useful for kendo??? -- but the armour's way cool, so why change :-) )
    • Well, considering that it IS being used, and seems to be quite effective, I'd think that the answer to your comment is that it's not just the point of impact.
      Maybe this is why people don't like hanging out with geeks... no fucking common sense.
    • It isn't primarily the hardness but the stiffness that prevents blunt impact injury in armor design. The impulse is distributed over a wide area so that the peak force is less than the threshold for bruising. Crumpling is used in secondary foam in helmets (which does not contact the wearer directly). In helmets, the outer shell, the resilient inner foam and the skull provide the force-spreading function. Crumpling is not relevant to armor design since the purpose is not to absorb the energy but to distribu
    • These suits provide protective padding for RACERS so they don't suffer bruises or breaks when the hit the gates. These suits are NOT for crashes.

      I am a competitive alpine ski racer. Watch the slalom (SL) events in the Olympics and you will see that every athlete wears hard protective equipment on his poles (to protect his hands), his shins, and usually on his head. This is because the tightest, shortest, fastest line down the course involves literally running over the gate. The athlete generally "cross-bloc

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