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Virgin Galactic to Build Space Port in New Mexico
Posted by
ScuttleMonkey
on Wed Dec 14, 2005 07:26 AM
from the area-fifty-two dept.
from the area-fifty-two dept.
aapold writes "Virgin Galactic today announced plans to build a $225 million space port in southern New Mexico. Richard Branson will meet with governor Bill Richardson Wednesday to unveil the plans. Virgin Galactic is the company leveraging Spaceship One which, as reported by Slashdot, claimed the Ansari X prize for commercial space flight."
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Exciting times (Score:5, Interesting)
I cant wait until my first moon-vacation
Re:Exciting times (Score:4, Insightful)
I think you meant to say "the real exploitation of space can begin". Think high velocity spacecraft junk is a problem now, wait till you have disposable camera wrappers and discarded "Welcome to Space!" flyers zooming around up there.
Parent
Re:Exciting times (Score:2)
There's also nothing wrong with exploiting space. It's not like it's a person who you're taking advantage of. It is a resource, nothing more.
-Erwos
Re:Exciting times (Score:3, Interesting)
Basically, by the time that we have enough industry that creating space pollution is a serious problem, we should have the technology to start thinking about junk removal
Re:Exciting times (Score:4, Funny)
Until a paperclip tears through your passenger cabin at 10km/s
Parent
Re:Exciting times (Score:5, Insightful)
Try telling that to NASA the next time that they are about to shift the orbit of the Shuttle or the ISS because of a possible collision with debris in orbit. I sure they will be relieved to find out that it doesn't really matter and they don't need to bother. And the astronauts that have been on orbit during collisions with debris will probably be doubly relieved to find that it was just an insignificant event and nothing to worry about.
some links:
NASA Orbital Debris Program Office : http://www.orbitaldebris.jsc.nasa.gov/ [nasa.gov]y /gallarypage/sts7crack.jpg [nasa.gov] y /gallarypage/ldefpanel.jpg [nasa.gov]
picture of damage to the shuttle front window:
http://www.orbitaldebris.jsc.nasa.gov/photogaller
picture of a panel that was left in orbit for over 5 years and then brought back for examination:
http://www.orbitaldebris.jsc.nasa.gov/photogaller
Parent
Re:Exciting times (Score:3, Funny)
Then the spacecraft operators will need to inform their customers to keep their hands and feet inside the spaceship at all times and keep all doors and windows securely fastened.
Re:Exciting times (Score:3, Funny)
Sheesh! There are some people who have way too much money.
They'll be the first ones up against the wall when the revolution comes!
Yeah!, them and those wasters who post to slashdot!
Bugger.
Re:Exciting times (Score:3, Funny)
I'd like to see ..... (Score:3, Interesting)
Imagine a platform at 160,000 feet, that uses a mass driver to toss cargo into low orbit
High altitude ballons could carry the cargo to the platform 30 miles above the earth
NASA has already done a small scale version of this
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2002/08/02082 7063353.htm [sciencedaily.com]
It would be a huge and complex task, but imagine a giant platform with many ballons in case one
fails, and a magnetic mass driver near the center to toss cargo into low orbit
Hardly (Score:3, Informative)
AND, people at MIT have built mass drivers, and used them on terra firma! And other people have thought about using them on the moon.
That's what your links say. Oh, and an offhand comment, that "SSI is conducting a feasibility study on the use of an aerostatically supported mass driver for terrestrial launch of bulk payloads." Just that sentence, nothing more.
The reaction force from the launch would be enormous, though--F=m*a, so take whatever
Re:Hardly (Score:3, Interesting)
Very precise-hitting missiles are known to be launchable from hunks of steel flying miles above the earth. Once launched, in other words, the rocket can correct itself even if the platform oscillated and stumbled because of the launch.
Re:Hardly (Score:3, Funny)
Good for Business? (Score:2, Interesting)
The commercial opportunities must far outweigh those potential problems.
Re:Good for Business? (Score:2, Insightful)
You are absolutely correct, (Score:5, Funny)
Parent
Space == Money (Score:5, Interesting)
No kidding. Branson's investement is pretty much a no brainer. Estimates of price per ticket are at around $200,000 dollars a seat, times seven passengers is $1.4 million dollars in cash per flight.
Branson's in the airline business already. I'm not sure about the specifics of it, but I seriously doubt that there are any regular commercial flights out there that pull in $1.4 million dollars per trip. Even those that come close would be 747 type aircraft that probably cost as much to run as SpaceShipTwo will anyway. Can we get some figures here?
Now I would have said that Branson's best bet was to set up shop in some middle of nowhere location, to dodge regulations. But the fact that he's setting up shop inside the US shows that he's serious about doing things professionally. Nonetheless I expect customers will be expected to sign off in the event of an accident.
As to potential customers. Does anyone seriously suggest that Branson won't be able to find people willing to spend $200,000 on a trip into orbit. There are thousands of people who spend ten times that on a boat. I think he'll manage to fill a plane once a week at least.
Step 1: Wait for private group to develop initial technology.
Step 2: Buy group and its technology.
Step 3: Scale up development
Step 4: Charge suckers $200,000 per flight AND satisfy them
Step 3: PROFIT!!
Parent
Re:Good for Business? (Score:5, Informative)
noise pollution : No one is going to notice.. well, no HUMAN is going to notice. Between TorC (as everyone calls is) and Las Cruces.. there is a whole lot of NOTHING. Just miles and miles and miles of desert. Well, there are a couple of very small communities if you stay next to the interstate.
traffic problems : Non issue there is hardly any traffic now.. the road would be a little busier because peopel would have to live in TorC or Las Cruces that is a plus for both cities.
money that the populace argues would be better spent elsewhere : HAH! I take it you have never seen the area... Go 4 minutes outside the city limits of Las Cruces and you are IN the third world country within the USA. This will pump millions of MUCH NEEDED money into the area.
They have been waiting 10+ years for this. It is nice to see it finally happening. One section of Las Cruces even split off a few years back (~ '96-'97).. became incorperated and called temselves "spaceport City" because they were dead sure that a spaceport would be built by '99. By late '98 and early '99 they were out of money (they had to make a lot of improvements to fit the terms of becoming a city) and the residents dumped the idea and voted to become a 'burb of Las Cruces again and forget the whole incorperation thing.
Parent
NM (Score:5, Informative)
As for 3rd world, a couple of interesting facts (which might be outdated). NM has the highest school dropout rate and the highest PhD per capita. AND the bordor patrol has a station NORTH of Las Cruces. Putting it south of there would interfer with international commuters.
Parent
Re:Good for Business? (Score:4, Informative)
Parent
Re:Good for Business? (Score:3, Interesting)
Careful there.... (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Careful there.... (Score:5, Insightful)
Two points:
1) They have a practical source of income - with the first two million allready accounted for
2) "Tech companies" did not fail to constrain costs in the late 1990s, internet startups failed to have viable business plans. There is a big difference.
Parent
Re:Careful there.... (Score:3, Funny)
2) "Tech companies" did not fail to constrain costs in the late 1990s, internet startups failed to have viable business plans. There is a big difference.
What's not viable about selling dimes for nickels and making up the loss in volume?
Re:Careful there.... (Score:4, Informative)
Of course, Branson [wikipedia.org] is a businessman with a successful track record [wikipedia.org], and his personal fortune of approximately $5,300 million [wikipedia.org] would allow him to absorb the complete failure of this $225 million spaceport (although obviously no-one would want to lose that much money).
Michael
Parent
Hmm (Score:3, Funny)
Low population density significantly reduces the cost of the space flight program? I guess they're assuming there will be some bourgeois shrapnel flying around.
I wonder what the road sign looks like that warns against burning appendages falling from the sky.
Re:Hmm (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Hmm (Score:4, Informative)
Actually, that's correct, from the standpoint of safety. They can't afford to immolate too many people if one of these things crashes or explodes for some reason. The area south of T-or-C and north of Las Cruces is sparsely populated, mostly open area, and is bordered to the east by White Sands, and even further east by Roswell. I'm sure Virgin Galactic is hoping to lure the ET contingent. Anyway, they're trying to keep the insurance rates down.
NASA originally considered the White Sands area for launching the Apollo Saturn V, but decided it was too dangerous, as one Saturn V carried the destructive power of an atomic bomb. They did do engine testing for the Lunar Module and Service Module there.
And if you drive north of T-or-C to the small town of San Antonio, you can stop at the Owl Bar and Cafe for the best green chile cheeseburgers in all the world. [end shameless plug]
Parent
Awesome (Score:5, Funny)
and in a few months (Score:2, Funny)
that is on the equator, facing east, and with good infrastructure around
now is the time to buy
Re:and in a few months (Score:2)
Re:and in a few months (Score:4, Funny)
Parent
Chump Change... (Score:3, Interesting)
They spent $800 million on a new launch center... IN 1962
Strategic location (Score:3, Funny)
Nothing to see here (Score:2)
Mexican Spaceport (Score:2, Funny)
non-orbital (Score:5, Informative)
Re:non-orbital (Score:5, Insightful)
The technology for sub-orbital flights obviously has been around for a long time. Yet the costs involved for even sub-orbital launches have always been high due them being entirely governmental companies. The X-Prize was setup to find out the cheapest way to get the ordinary person into space, whereas the state space programs have always been about pushing the boundaries of human exploration. The cheapest way is to only go as far as the edge of space to save massively on the thrust and energy requirements. The savings that this makes can then be offset by using a less effective fuel (hybrid), but that has the advantage of being a lot safer. The hybrid engines use fuels that generally are easy to store safely (non of this cryogenic nonsense like the shuttle) and also can be switched off in the event of a malfunction (SRBs once lit burn all the way to the tip).
People will still have to pay $20 million to the russians to go into space for a few days, so there is still going to be a large gap between those that go sub-orbital and the few that can afford to pay for orbital space access.
Parent
Further ways to reduce costs (Score:2, Funny)
1. Let discovery channel make a documentary "Megastructures: Building the spaceport" and get paid for it (ofcourse).
2. Rent the spaceport, still under construction out to the movie: Space comboys II: Now the spaceport is broken, and they have to fix that before a spaceship can land. Ofcourse one of the cowboys is on board to keep it unpredictably longer in robit by burning the furniture in the engines, and to make the impossible landing.
3. Lots of mov
Ugh. PHB-speak ahoy! (Score:5, Informative)
Whatever happened to the verb 'to use'? As in 'Virgin Galactic is the company using Spaceship One'.
Anyone who uses the word 'leverage' in any context where the concept of newton metres is absent, or as a verb in any context at all, deserves to be slapped about the face with a kipper until they're sorry.
Re:Ugh. PHB-speak ahoy! (Score:3, Funny)
Oooh-ooh, maybe I should start to leverage my scientific vocabulary slightly incorrectly. Only then will we gain the amplitude to become managers.
Let's torque these bugs
I received a mole of spam this morning.
I'm hoping my open source app will gain popularity through osmosis.
I sent the UI to the usability lab for some titration.
His technical knowledge lead him to become a singularity around the office.
I could come up with more, but this topic is too volatile.
Philippe Starck to design (Score:3, Interesting)
fraud and exaggeration (Score:4, Insightful)
Some people might think that they are going to all of the trouble and expense of digging out tunnels and pits to construct living quarters, maintenance, etc. is for energy efficiency or something.
The real reason is more unsavory.
If you are announcing your intention to build a conventional (above ground) 60,000 square foot multi-building compound, it will be obvious to everyone if you only build the first 5000 square foot building, and leave the rest for when you actually turn a profit. If it's "90 percent underground", then you can just dig out for that first little structure, put a few 5' side tunnels on and install locked doors in front of the dirt. Who can tell the difference? If you slap labels like "Authorized Personnel Only" or "Hazardous Area - Do Not Enter", then you don't have to open the doors for the reporters who come to tour the "spaceport".
What this means is that they can put up a few sheds and bunkers above ground, build one showcase underground structure to show the reporters and passengers (who come in one or two at a time). Have a few bulldozers and dumptrucks drive around for awhile "building" the rest, then call it a spaceport. That might give them enough time to do a few flights to get the money coming in, then they can actually build the rest of it (probably above ground, with a cover story about how the original underground plans were too expensive). If the project tanks, they walk away without having sunk a lot of money in the thing.
If you can't see it, it isn't there.
Re:fraud and exaggeration (Score:3, Funny)
Bad news: Interspecies red light district . . . (Score:3, Funny)
And even then, the alien brothels won't take worthless earth-currency.
Of course, you could get some house credit by volunteering to have a horny L'CHHHTTTTHhhh plunge her ovipositer into your abdomen. The house doctor can usually dig the eggs out in time. But still, after a few times you get a reputation and . . .
Oh, sorry, this is a Virgin Spaceport. No red light district. The only bars serve lemonade and alcohol free margaritas.
Stefan
Re:Wouldn't it be better... (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Wouldn't it be better... (Score:4, Informative)
Yes,
It is only you.
At present the only viable way to get into space is using rockets. Therefor we're going to need somewhere for the rockets to take off and land.
Parent
Re:Another one for the Brits! (Score:3, Insightful)
But putting people in space is expensive, dangerous, and also futile, as it takes far too long to actually go anywhere at present. NASA has pushed back the boundaries constantly with the many probes it has sent out since the 60s, which are a much more c
Re:New Orleans would be better... (Score:3, Informative)
Re:As a Virgin North West Trains user (Score:5, Informative)
Centro: litter everywhere, dirty, run down looking, rude/bored and occasionally abusive ticket collectors, no information at all on delays, connections, no shop, no power points, toilets usually filthy
Virgin: generally clean - they have a cleaner on every train, toilets OK, on board shop, staff generally polite, friendly and cheerfull looking, good information about delays, transfers, connections etc etc
Richard Branson said he would introduce High Speed trains and no one really believed him but now they are in service and he has pretty much delivered what he promised he would.
Parent